Mehri's Charges of Racism in Ad Biz (Discussed on The BeanCast)

Bill Green poses some really good points for discussion on this topic over at Make the Logo Bigger.

He was on my show, The BeanCast, last night to discuss, and the conversation offered some great perspective. Admittedly, none of us who were on the show are minorities, (Hal Goodtree, Duane Forrester and Bill and me) but even so we came to a consensus that racism does indeed exist. It may be passive most of the time, but it's there.

Bill was actually at the initial open meeting that Mehri had and he says it was "eye-opening" to hear about the patterns of discrimination.

What are your thoughts? I know it's uncomfortable and has been discussed to death, but I'm wondering if any of your positions are changing as we live with the subject.

Bob

Tags: beancast, cyrus+mehri, discrimination, marketing+podcast, mehri, racism, the+beancast

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Permalink Reply by Bob Knorpp on January 15, 2009 at 11:52am

I added some additional links and resources on the issue, courtesy of Bill Green. Hope it helps.

Click here to get the blog post, complete with a range of links.

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Permalink Reply by TJ on January 15, 2009 at 3:31pm

Shame this subject doesn't have more looks and responses to it because its a great issue to discuss. I think the problem is that nowadays, most people think that by simply "averting their eyes" to the problem (figuratively and literally)...that it doesn't exist...and sadly, to some level of personal situational awareness and moral responsibility - it doesn't.

Should have put "Nigger Businessmen"..."Peckerwood CEO's" or "Honkey ASS Boardrooms" in the discussion title...

Some people don't look up unless they can watch the car wreck in real time.

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Permalink Reply by Bob Knorpp on January 15, 2009 at 4:16pm

I had considered that my title about "Mehri" was a little obtuse. But then, in a way that's an indictment in and of itself. If you're in this industry and don't know the name "Mehri," you're living with your head in the sand!

But given the reality, I see about changing the title.

Bob

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Permalink Reply by Bob Knorpp on January 15, 2009 at 4:26pm

Not specifically singling you out. LOL

The comment was intended more in a general sense that no one seemed to be stopping in to read the discussion.

Sorry for the confusion.

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Permalink Reply by Buddy 'Friendly' Wachenheimer on January 15, 2009 at 7:32pm

I do. I want to hear your REAL thoughts on this matter. No candy coating. No pulling of punches. Spit it out...

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Permalink Reply by Bill Green on January 28, 2009 at 2:23am

Just to clarify, it wasn’t eye-opening for me because I’ve seen it all over, but it would be for others who haven’t.

As noted below too by TJ, Harry Webber should also be added into the links.

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Permalink Reply by Mary Baum on March 5, 2009 at 7:06pm

Some years back I realized I had never met another female agency art director in St. Louis. I had met graphic designers . . . and in fact I have always made it very clear that I am NOT a graphic designer, because around here as soon as you say the word 'graphic' that means glorified production artist . . . there had been some female art directors at Maritz, which goes out of its way to assure people that it's not an agency.

Now, here's the kicker. When I finally put that together, I had been on my own (again) for close to ten years. And I was almost, if not already, 45 years old. Maybe certain things hadn't quite been all my fault . . .

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Permalink Reply by Mary Baum on March 6, 2009 at 12:17am

OMG- you're an MCCer! I refused to even interview there at the beginning of my career because I didn't want to drive to Fenton, MO from the inner ring of St. Louis suburbs - but karma won't be denied. I wound up there in '89 and spent the four best years of my employed life there, until March 31, 1993, when the magic ended. The next morning a bigger sister company took us over - you may have heard it called the Motivation company at the time (and now, after at least two other names, they're calling it that again!) and started the process of purging a great many of us over the next two to three years. I would last slightly more than one - but took a third operating unit - the research company - with me as a client when I left.

But if you could fall in love with this business after an entire summer doing nothing but mounting and flapping photos and keylines - and mixing rubber cement by hand - no wax? no spray mount, even? in a territory ruled, as I recall, by the Mikes Whyte of legend and Craven who may well still be installed in Southfield as we speak - you are truly an MCCer of the blood, driven by nothing so much as the quality of the work. (You also clearly are not ADD. How different would my life be now if I had started Ritalin 30 years ago instead of three?)

And, yes, I certainly do remember marketer layouts, and tissue paper, and type galleys. I remember $600 type bills for a black-and-white newspaper ad, and $2500 tabletop photography shoots, to achieve production values that now cost me $20 at iStockphoto (or twenty minutes with the DSLR) and an afternoon with keyboard and mouse . . . Remember how out-of-reach color photo retouching was for all but the biggest clients? Five figures! - for stuff we all do now, ourselves, so easily we can talk on the phone or do some other kind of multitasking?

But back to MCC Detroit. I'm sure you're correct that the creative department was lily white when you were there - but I am happy to report that one of the best IT guys the training division ever had was - and still is among the best in the country, I'm sure - an African American named Mark Grady, who came with the Detroit company we bought and then made over into the Detroit office. But it's more than possible he had already moved to St. Louis by the time you arrived on the scene. He's one of my connections on LinkedIn, and he's now at AG Edwards/Wachovia/Wells Fargo/different name next week. All these years after the work he did for MCC, I hoped he'd be at a rather senior level - a director or a vp - wherever he is now, but his title is a variation on project manager or group leader, maybe at a senior end of the range.

That sticks in my craw - and knowing Mark, I'm sure if anyone asks, he says things like he's really happier doing the projects he's doing. But I can't imagine he's happier making a middle-management income instead of a senior-level one.

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Permalink Reply by Mary Baum on March 6, 2009 at 4:49pm

Very.

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Permalink Reply by Bob Knorpp on January 28, 2009 at 12:51pm

Wow! Some great thoughts.

I have to ask what you find to be the greater challenge. Is it race issues or gender issues? I've done panels regarding each topic on different shows and got some wildly divergent opinions. Just wondering.

Bob

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Permalink Reply by martin Leach on January 30, 2009 at 3:51pm

After reading most of your intelligent and well thought out commentary I was shocked to find out you don't believe there is a black or white culture. There is Definitely a black culture and a white culture in the U.S., along with countless others. I think one of the main roadblocks to good race relations in this country is not recognizing how different we are from one another. I grew up in a small, predominantly white town in Northern California and I remember one day in high school I was having a discussion with a black kid in my class. I made some comment about how we are all human, therefore all the same. He looked at me with raised eyebrows and said "Yeah, but were different. There's a big difference. White people, black people; were all human, but there's definitely a difference." At that time I didn't really understand what he meant. Years later I moved to Miami and found out what he was talking about. The differences between white people and black people contrast as much as their skin colors. Black people eat different food, wear different clothes, speak differently, listen to different music etc. I'm not gonna whip out the Websters definition of the word "culture," but I think the differences are difinitive enough to collectively call them a culture. Are you familiar with the phrase "jump the broom"? I am, but that phrase doesn't exist in my white culture. I had to ask what it meant. How about "redbone"? I know what that word means because I bartended a black party called "Super Crunk Sunday" for over a year. Super Crunk? That is so Southern Black. Which leads me to another point. There are huge cultural differences from region to region in the U.S. as well. I moved to Miami with a laid back, friendly California attitude. When I first arrived here I wondered what on God's green earth was wrong with everybody. The prevailing culture in Miami is snobbish, stand-offish and impolite. People's self importance is more prevalant here than other areas. New Yorkers are famously stand-offish, but this is because they typically have an agenda, not because they think their shit doesn't stink. So, sure, I watch the same cable as the black guy across town from me. We probably eat the same fast food, watch the same movies and get the same news. But all that is cultural infrastructure. The way we were brought up and the culture we were raised in will dictate our daily behavior more than our universal access to running water and electricity(those are blessings). Oh, Teresa, I'm always grateful for a thinker.

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Permalink Reply by martin Leach on January 31, 2009 at 4:33pm

Interesting points. I'm at a disadvantage here because you can write better and faster than me. I'm hoping this is because you have many more years of experience in the field and not because you are black and female. This topic is too complex to sort out in writing, so I'm going to just start posting pictures and videos like TJ when I want to say something. Of course what I'm "saying" wont be as eloquent as what you write, Teresa. Seriously though, I can't keep up with you.