Mehri's Charges of Racism in Ad Biz (Discussed on The BeanCast)
Bill Green poses some really good points for discussion on this topic over at Make the Logo Bigger.
He was on my show, The BeanCast, last night to discuss, and the conversation offered some great perspective. Admittedly, none of us who were on the show are minorities, (Hal Goodtree, Duane Forrester and Bill and me) but even so we came to a consensus that racism does indeed exist. It may be passive most of the time, but it's there.
Bill was actually at the initial open meeting that Mehri had and he says it was "eye-opening" to hear about the patterns of discrimination.
What are your thoughts? I know it's uncomfortable and has been discussed to death, but I'm wondering if any of your positions are changing as we live with the subject.
Bob
He was on my show, The BeanCast, last night to discuss, and the conversation offered some great perspective. Admittedly, none of us who were on the show are minorities, (Hal Goodtree, Duane Forrester and Bill and me) but even so we came to a consensus that racism does indeed exist. It may be passive most of the time, but it's there.
Bill was actually at the initial open meeting that Mehri had and he says it was "eye-opening" to hear about the patterns of discrimination.
What are your thoughts? I know it's uncomfortable and has been discussed to death, but I'm wondering if any of your positions are changing as we live with the subject.
Bob
Tags: beancast, cyrus+mehri, discrimination, marketing+podcast, mehri, racism, the+beancast
Views: 0
Replies to This Discussion
-
Permalink Reply by Buddy 'Friendly' Wachenheimer on
-
Cross dressing again huh? Goddamn you make an ugly bitch, TJ!
This look required NO need for a g-string, yet you choose to wear one. What was that all about, chum? Did you feel the need for something different other than a turd, gerbil, penis, or a dildo in the old poop-shoot? Please explain, inquiring minds neeeeeeeeed to know.
-
-
. . .So you didn't like it as well as a gerbil, huh?
-
-
-
Touché .)
-
-
Permalink Reply by Angela Glenn on
-
O. M. G.
-
Permalink Reply by philip chudy on -
It would be great to listen to the preaching if the preacher displayed artistry in this particular skill.
Stream of consciousness is wonderful, whether in ads or in life - - when coming from someone who has earned ones confidence. Confidence meaning the most basic communication skill - - that they would not use a flighty sentence, an oblique gesture, jazzy rendering or a super hip presentation, when an articulate, straightforward or even pedestrian offering is possible.
Why bother accepting an invitation to process other people's thoughts when it is like: 'eat this food - I could not be bothered to finish preparing the meal - but, looks like you are trash anyway, so just eat what you are given - - and I have real cooking skills, great ingredients but it sucks for you if you can’t figure out how to finish the meal the way I would have - - bad luck huh'.
Stream of consciousness from a trusted source might just contain something special or transcendent and everyone wants to listen - otherwise it will just be rejected as noise.
If you see a fire in the room, you shout 'fire' - since when do you recite poetry, do a hip little dance or make creative multimedia presentations?
This hypothetical room - - well, we are all in this room now
Pray, where then is the real weight, what is the real danger and what exactly are we drinking?
Methinks that thinks there is nothing exclusive about recognizing the presence or absence of glow and Elvis has most certainly left the room quite a while ago.
-
Permalink Reply by Harry Webber on
-
Phillip,
You approach a subject that has left your continent one of the most dangerous locations on Earth with a raped natural infrastructure, a political system that puts a lower value on human life than on their ability to shovel the contents of their national treasury into a few choice numbered off-shore account and test bed for one of the most diabolical biological ethnic cleaning campaigns ( underwriting the manufacturing of the AIDS virus by the French)since the gas chambers of Auschwitz. Man's inhumanity to man based upon an accident of skin pigmentation.
I sense, from the comments between you and Ms. Jay, elsewhere on this thread, that you are in possession of some native form of intelligence that comprehends the seriousness of the topic at hand. This is confirmed by your conflagration analogy.
Allow your well tuned intellect to consider this. Advertising is a sunset industry. It produces a work product that is neither wanted, needed or trusted by it's intended audience. In short, it a worthless drain on the economies of it's patrons the global enterprise community and a valueless add-on to every product or service sold anywhere in the world.
Now add to that the arrogance and unfathomable ignorance of a management culture so myopic as to set itself above the accepted norm of equal opportunity, even after having been challenged for four decades by government, NGO's, trade organizations, trade and news media and the righteous indignation of the offended parties. A management so inept that it has allowed those parties to escalate their cause to the doorstep of the industry's life-blood. Their installed client base. This sir, goes beyond ignorance and dull-wittedness. We are now looking into the face of insanity.
You have chosen (wisely) not to direct your scolding to any particular participant in these posts(other than the elusive Elvis). So having been stuck with that unfortunate tag, and having nothing better to do on Sunday than answer your thoughts, with a few of my own. I submit this for your consideration.
Let us consider the fact that a citizen of one of the most heinous regimes in modern history (the former Rhodesia and subsequent dictatorship)has considered himself the voice of reason in this discussion. One would think that such reason would be better served being applied to your own country, where thug rule has turned one of the most vibrant economies in Africa into one of the most desolate.
You are one of the rare whites who did not turn tail and run. In many ways that makes you a patriot at most and a person who loves his nation with all of its flaws enough to remain firmly planted in the very jaws of hell, at least. It should be no problem for you to see where this is same intolerance that almost killed Morgan Tsvangirai after finally toppling the Mugabe regime is leading the U.S. advertising industry.
Tell me sir. Did you shout fire in your room? Are you shouting fire now, as YOUR room begins to burn? Or have you too left the room long, long ago. So that this post may be easily disregarded as one more bit of noise.
-
Permalink Reply by philip chudy on
-
Harry, there are many interesting things you touch on above which would require more time to explore than I can spare right now
Least interesting to everyone except me is 'me' part but this is quick and easy to respond to.
I left Rhodesia as a young man (19) under protest to the white supremacists - - also facing the inability to remain unless I succumbed to the draft. I left and returned often for short period over many years, having non draftable family members who remained there.
I tried to return to the country to live and play a role in independent Zimbabwe. Although I was born there and my family did their best to ignore/break the color bar in their lifetimes as well as to promote majority rule, I am denied the right to live/work there or regain my birthright nationality. The denial is complete because of the color of my white skin and nothing else.
Paradoxically the former white racists are closer to being drinking buddies with the present bunch of leaders than I would ever be - - just as I observed how the heroic anti communists seemed to get on so swimmingly well with the hard line communists at diplomatic parties soon after independence.
Regarding shouting fire then - the answer is yes - but never loud enough and yes it is also true that I left that room so long ago that my views on the state of things are pretty distant.
Sadly, it is not only I, but half of the country (mostly the best and most educated half - both white and black) now end up being similarly distant - in voluntary or involuntary exile. There is plenty of noise (as well as shouting fire) from all of us about the current situation and meantime the really brave people remain in the country standing us as best they can with very little help from anywhere in the world. Shouting fire from outside the can feel about as inconsequential as being beaten to a pulp in a remote piece of bush where the news of injustice will never get out - but this is where we begin.
I would admit that my views on race are rather limited and veer towards being classed as noise. That said, it would be nice if considering things from a slightly different viewpoint ends up being even slightly helpful to anyone.
I like to think I have some useful insights into African culture as well as the European attitudes may be seen to be manifest in racist scenarios but it is as with most, a work in progress.
I will try to articulate a few fledgling ideas in due course
-
Permalink Reply by Harry Webber on
-
Phillip,
Your life gives great context to your worldview. This is a discussion that requires context to determine the validity of content. As a result, I salute the recent housecleaning of this thread by saner minds. It hardly
rates the buffoonery recently submitted as commentary.
The Japanese who boast of one of the most segregated societies on the planet have never had a civil rights issue presented to their governing body. When questioned on that point a few years ago their Premier Hayato Ikeda stated that the Japanese believe that interaction between people is a matter of personal choice and as such cannot be mandated by government edict. So much for equal rights under the law in Japan. Many societies around the world feel the same. As does the society of advertising practitioners here in America.
I look forward to your perspective in coming posts.
-
Permalink Reply by philip chudy on
-
Racism not being my fave rave subject, it takes a bit of doing to get back to it. I cannot and dont want to comment in any way about employment practices within ad agencies, since I never worked in one (nor as an employee for any company, ever).
I dont know whether anyone has any thoughts as to whether there are racist attitudes expressed or suggested by/in the content of contemporary advertising. I cant say I have thought that one through either but not a lot comes to mind. On the other hand I can think of an awful lot of advertising which apparently seeks to transcend racist stereotypes - or, perhaps more accurately, to raise the morale/status or diverse racial profiles.
What does interest me are stereotypes and, in as far as advertisers are expected to understand and be in tune with them, it is what keeps me interested in the mechanics of our business.
Racism is not necessarily to do with stereotypes (reference 'show me the money'), but it is often cited as a prime area where one can 'start to disassemble racism'.
...Well the racially dominant groups would say that, wouldn't they.
All that said - of advertising was a 'racial entity/group/thingie', it you would find it hanging in the safest and most comfortable parts of town (or the gentrified ghetto, as the case may be).
Should this be the case? I think it will always be the way it is but surely it is open to discussion.
-
Permalink Reply by TJ on -
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,515875,00.html
So...Still think the events happening in Africa aren't inadvertently fueling MORE world-related racism?
Groups
-
Ads of the World
559 members
-
Non-Traditional & Altern…
407 members
-
Creative Directors Club
403 members
-
Copywriter Group
231 members
-
Social Marketing Group
191 members
Birthdays
Badge
© 2012 Created by Steve Hall.
